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J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight

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Offline maine516

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #30 on: December 21, 2013, 03:28:58 AM »
Thanks, I'll look into "Tomboy".  JT's books are mainly the only ones I've read so far containing catfights, so tips on other authors are helpful.

There's a book called "Country Sex - Country Style" by Arlene Shelton.  The book cover has a nice drawing of two women catfighting outdoors fully naked.  I've read an excerpt from the book that has two women fighting after falling off their horses into a stream.  The fight evolves into a violent, deadly if I recall, catfight/sexfight combination.  Although I liked part of the description, I wasn't crazy about how it evolved.  You guys may not be interested in this book, but you can look it up if you are.   

I also went back to Seakings Femfight site and looked up the story called "Western Wildcats" by Diane from 2011.  I forgot who mentioned this - was that you coffeemug?  The first fight is actually taken from JT's "Diamonds, Emeralds, Cards and Colts" with the names changed.  But I did find some good stuff in there, especially the theme of the same two women fighting each other multiple times in different locations.

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Offline CoffeeMug

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #31 on: December 21, 2013, 05:59:26 AM »
Yeah, I was the one who mentioned "Western Wildcats."  It's the story in which the first person narrator gives us events that take place while she's unconscious.   :-\

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Offline JT Edson

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #32 on: December 21, 2013, 12:56:44 PM »
I really appreciate all the information flowing thru this thread. Some of it I knew, some of are reminders and some of it are real nuggets to bring me back to the search in my area for more of the real JT Edson's books as well as others.

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Offline maine516

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #33 on: December 21, 2013, 06:04:04 PM »
Again, I really liked the thread in "Western Wildcats" of the same 2 women fighting each other several times in different locations; in a barn, in a building, after a chase etc.  I recall one fight where they faced each other with guns drawn, called it a stalemate, quickly agreed to holster their guns, then dropped their gun belts simultaneously to go at it tooth and nail.  Great stuff!  Thanks again.

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Offline CoffeeMug

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #34 on: December 29, 2013, 12:54:11 AM »
Update!

Finally got my copy of Wanted! Belle Starr.  It's basically three long stories stitched together.  The last one has a great fight between Belle and a blonde female con artist named (I swear, I'm not making this up) Amelia Penelope Diana "Benkers" Benkinsop.  Belle and APDBB are alone in a room for the fight, and are equally beautiful and buxom etc.  The first story has a good lead-up to a fight between Belle and a slender blonde, but nothing comes of it.  I'd give the BS-APDBB fight an A for sure.

I had said that I would get The Quiet Town and Trouble Busters, but on Amazon, they're too expensive for me to justify.  I did order Bunduki and The Lawmen of Rockabye County, so I'll report on those once they arrive.

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Offline maine516

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #35 on: January 02, 2014, 04:44:54 AM »
Happy New Year!

CoffeeMug - Just fyi, Amelia Benkinsop supposedly also has a fight in Blonde Genius.  I don't have that one yet myself so I can't comment on it.  If you don't have them, a couple of other good fights are in Waco's Badge, which you may have, between Belle Starr and Sarah, and Cold Deck, Hot Lead, between Calamity Jane and Sal Banyon.  Also, Oklahoma Outlaw is the same book as Wanted! Belle Starr, so be careful not to duplicate that one.  Keep looking for affordable copies of Quiet Town and Trouble Busters.  The "Acceptable" least expensive, level of book quality is probably good enough to get the fight descriptions.

sinclairfan - I'm still intrigued by your idea that Eve Coniston and Pauline Cushman could be the same person.  I went back to check Chapter 7 of Bloody Border.  There's a paragraph on page 69 that seems to indicate that they are different with Eve being annoyed by the amount of publicity given to Pauline's more famously known exploits.  That said, I may be missing what you're seeing in that chapter.  Also, the events in Bloody Border take place in April, 1865 where Eve is described as being in her mid-thirties.  In Back to the Bloody Border, which takes place just after the end of the War, and is probably still in 1865, Eve is killed by Sylvie Caillard in Mexico.  In The Texan, there's a chapter called "The Major" and it's mainly about Pauline Cushman.  She is described as having been in a theatrical troupe that toured the country and after the War married Jere Fryer, who was also in the troupe.  They then bought the Casa Grande Hotel, which I think is in New Mexico, and she also acted as the unofficial mayor there for some time.  She is about 40 then and continues to live in that town at the end of that story. From all of this, I'm tending to think they are not the same person.  What makes this comparison interesting to me though is that they both have black hair, are described as being about the same height, build and look.  Their ages are also similar and the timelines of the stories could possibly match up.  The fact that Eve is killed right after the war, and Pauline is described as being married, owner of a hotel and still alive at forty seems to indicate that they are two different people though.  I'm interested in hearing if you have more insight that they are the same person though.

Also, I did do a little checking on your suggestion of "Tomboy".  I'm an older guy and since this is about juvenile gangs, it's probably not what I'm looking for.  My preference is for more mature women fights.  I know some (many) of the women (girls) in JT's westerns are only in their twenty's, but some are older than that and I just love the western catfight theme.  For now, I'll keep with my "hobby" of tracking down more of JT's books until I get closer to the end of that trail (no western pun intended).  But I'll make note of your suggestion as a future possibility.


Lastly, I just finished Young Ole Devil. There's a fight outdoors near the end between good girl Diamond (Di) Hitch Brindley and bad girl Madeline de Moreau. It's not too bad but it's not a major battle. Men are fighting at the same time and the catfight description alternates over a few pages along with the male fights.  It is however, as sinclairfan would say, a realistic fight and is pretty good on that level.  The fight does not come to a conclusion, with the two women being separated as other outlaws approach the fighting group.  "Di" actually takes a rifle shot at Madeline but misses and Madeline escapes by horseback.  The reader is left thinking that they could meet again for a rematch.  Enticing thought, only I don't know if that ever actually happens, or if it does, what book it would be in.

Let's hope the new year uncovers some real catfight story gems out there!

Thanks again for all of your input on this subject.  Keep posting updates if you come across anything of interest.


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Offline sinclairfan

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #36 on: January 02, 2014, 10:20:33 AM »
maine--It's possible I'm reading it completely wrong, but I thought the point of the Eve Coniston discussion in Chapter 7 is that Eve Coniston is Pauline Cushman's cover name when she's hiring herself out for spying duties.

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Offline CoffeeMug

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #37 on: January 02, 2014, 04:52:59 PM »
Got my copy of Bunduki a few days ago.  It has one fight, between Dawn Drummond-Clayton and a girl the plot sets up to be what I'd call "second fiddle" among the ... locals?  I'd call the fight "good to very good" except that Dawn's hands are bound for the entire fight, which knocks it down a ways for me.  I'd give the fight itself just a B or B-.  However, the book heavily, heavily hints at what seems to me would be an amazing fight between Dawn and the lead female character among the indigenous people, Charole (Charole/Carol?).  I absolutely loved the book's introduction of Charole and eagerly read for their fight, but it isn't in here.  The review I'd read of the book is right, it really does seem like a book-long setup for more books.  Unfortunately, right now the other books in the series are pretty expensive.  Unless someone here can confirm which book the Charole-Dawn fight is in, and its quality, I have a hard time justifying $20 to find out for myself.

@maine  I looked up Blonde Genius online.  The only place I saw it for sale was a UK seller who had it at $50 + international shipping.  And it's listed as part of the publisher's "children's" books!  What a surprise for the kiddies.  Those other books you mentioned I already have.

Regarding Eve/Pauline:  I thought they were two different women.  I don't see what the payoff would be, plot- or entertain-wise, for Edson to have written that material in the two Eve-Belle Boyd books to mean that she was using an assumed name.  *shrugs*




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Offline CoffeeMug

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #38 on: January 02, 2014, 05:08:37 PM »
Also, I do write stories, which I've been posting over on Sea King's website under the name Kim.  Reading Edson's stuff got me interested in that sort of setting, and I decided to try it out in a new series.  I think I'll go ahead and post those in the Stories section here as well, if people want to check them out.


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Offline maine516

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #39 on: January 03, 2014, 04:28:20 AM »
I just checked amazon.com and didn't see a copy of Blonde Genius available.  And $50 would be too much for me too.  I did spot a "very good" copy of Trouble Busters on there for $5 though, if you're interested in the very good fight between Freddie Woods and Kate Kilgore.

By the way, do you guys believe some of the prices out there on JT's books.  I just saw that a hard cover of version of Gunsmoke Thunder had a price of $64,940!  Are you kidding me?  How could that, or any of his books command that price?

I didn't get the inference from chapter 7 of Bloody Border that Eve is Pauline's cover name.  I'll take another look at that chapter, but I'm  tending to believe that they are two different women.

I'm currently reading Guns In The Night.  I'll provide an update on that one shortly.

I'll also check out "Kim's" stories.

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Offline sinclairfan

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #40 on: January 03, 2014, 02:46:19 PM »
I don't think I'd pay $64,940 to be physically transported back in time to watch the actual Belle Boyd fight the actual Calamity Jane.

Diamonds, Emeralds, Cards, and Colts has a long tight featuring a 5'8" tough Russian blonde named Olga who is specifically brought to the U.S. to fight other women in arranged matches.

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Offline CoffeeMug

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #41 on: January 04, 2014, 02:14:15 AM »


Diamonds, Emeralds, Cards, and Colts has a long tight featuring a 5'8" tough Russian blonde named Olga who is specifically brought to the U.S. to fight other women in arranged matches.

??  I have Cards and Colts (the book's other title), and at the end it's revealed that "Olga" is actually Belle Starr.

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Offline sinclairfan

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #42 on: January 04, 2014, 03:13:57 PM »
coffee--I'm trying to read between the lines and need some help; Olga is specifically identified as blonde, but Belle Starr is a redhead--did Edson ever explain this?  Wig?  Dye-job?  Other?

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Offline maine516

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #43 on: January 04, 2014, 07:04:10 PM »
"Miss Olga Chernyshevsky" is indeed Belle Starr in one of her many disguises.  Belle is wearing a blonde wig (bottom of page 65, at the start of chapter 6).  I believe she was in disguise so she could take part in a big poker game at Honesty John's Tavern, where the outlaw clientele prefer anonymity and refrain from using or mentioning their real names.  Honest John knows it's Belle Starr though. It may be sated earlier, I can't recall without re-reading more of the book, but chapter 17 (page 189) reveals Belle to be Olga.

Although the fight between Belle and Irene is a real dandy, it looses a lot of my interest because it's largely a mud fight, which I have just about zero liking for.  I think JT was possibly pandering to the mud wrestling craze of the 80's when this book was published '86.  If the fight had been kept out of the mud element, I would have considered this one of my personal favorites.

What I found interesting was that the Metis woman Belle fought, Irene Beauville, is the same woman Calamity fights topless in the Whip and the Warlance.  Irene is of course killed in that battle.

coffeemug - I'm sorry to say this, but in Guns in the Night, which I'm reading now, Belle Starr is murdered.  I've just come across the part where she is found by Mark Counter, Dusty Fog and the Ysabel Kid.  This is mentioned in the appendix of other books, but this is apparently the book in which it happens.   





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Offline sinclairfan

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Re: J.T.Edson "Slip Gun" catfight
« Reply #44 on: January 04, 2014, 09:22:58 PM »
Thx for the Olga/Belle reference.

Now, back to Pauline Cushman--in her "The Texan" fight with Iris Pendleton, Pauline is referred to as "the Major".  Isn't this implying she's Eve Coniston?