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Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?

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Offline DoYouKnowWhoIAm?

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Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« on: January 02, 2017, 01:17:40 AM »
Before Ronda, female MMA was a minority sport, practiced mostly by amateur girls, for fun, and watched only by their friends and families .. and perverts like us.

Before Ronda, Dana White didn't have any female fighters in the UFC because he thought that nobody would be interested in watching them .. except friends and families and perverts like us. Lol.

There were a few pro females, but the peanuts they were paid didn't incentivise and motivate them enough to dedicate their lives to the sport and train as hard as their male counterparts.

The hype, attention and money that Ronda brought to female MMA was a game changer. Within a couple of years, the bar had been raised to a height that Ronda herself, with her limited striking skills, couldn't reach.

Any thoughts?
« Last Edit: January 02, 2017, 01:41:28 AM by DoYouKnowWhoIAm? »

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Offline T aka Tony

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2017, 02:31:08 AM »
To be quite honest what I watched was very confusing  .. Ronda had a complete media black out leading up to this fight. Her body language at the weigh in was a lacknowledge of confidence. Then the start of the fight. Ronda looked like a fish out of water. She got 3 million for that performance.
Cheers!

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Offline DogWithABone

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2017, 07:49:26 AM »
When Ronda was a judoka she fought at 154 pounds. When she started MMA she fought at 145 for Strikeforce. She was obviously undefeated, but she never faced anyone with even solid amateur striking skills. Cyborg was the 145 champion at the time and Ronda petitioned the company to let her drop down to 135, a weight she knew Cyborg couldn't make, for their title at that weight. Cyborg was the only real striker at either weight. Most 135 fighters, and most female fighters in general weren't cutting much weight and the ones that were (like Miescha Tate) were wrestlers/grapplers who Ronda could beat with her judo and submissions. Several of the women Ronda beat in Strikeforce/UFC to get to 12-0 were actually 125 or even 115 fighters outside of UFC. Many of them were barely amateur quality. Some of them, like McMann and Zingano, are mom's in their mid 30s.

There's also the issue of her trainer being well known in MMA circles as being a complete fraud. His two main fighters are Rousey and her boyfriend Travis Browne. Before Browne joined their camp, he was 16-2-1 as a pro and was a legit title contender. Since joining he's 2-3 and his wins are over a guy who was terrible and then retired and one who got cut by UFC after losing too much. Browne might get cut if he loses his next fight. The trainer is also under federal investigation for identity theft and tax fraud among other things. Basically he's a leach that wormed his way into Ronda's favor without ever improving any of her skills.

So, combine a lack of real competition with a pathetic trainer and she was ripe for the picking. Enter Holly Holm who was a pro boxer with nearly 40 fights on her resume. Holm is a patty cake puncher, only 9 KOs in more than 30 pro wins, but she's naturally bigger than Ronda and she has the footwork to avoid Ronda's only effective tactic of rushing straight forward, overpowering her smaller opponent, and throwing her to the ground for an armbar. Holm simply let Ronda run into her fists for a round and then kicked her head off. Next, enter Nunes who is naturally bigger than Ronda, has dynamite in her fists, and had good enough footwork to avoid Ronda's only effective attack.

The shorter answer is Ronda is a petulant child (her olympic judo coach has shredded her character in several interviews) who was able to bully people because they were smaller, often older, much less skilled, and she is a judo savant. Nunes and Holm were fighters before Ronda was, with Nunes doing MMA since 2008 and Holm boxing all the way back to 2002, they are just the types she was avoiding for the last 4-5 years. Her downfall was buying into the image of invincibility UFC created for her instead of working with a real trainer to get better at the full MMA game.
RIP the account of Sophie Cees.

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Offline jessiefite

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2017, 08:41:43 AM »
The history of female MMA in the UFC doesn't start with Rhonda Rousey.  It starts with Gina Carano ... a serious and talented fighter.

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Offline DogWithABone

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2017, 09:46:59 AM »
The history of female MMA in the UFC doesn't start with Rhonda Rousey.  It starts with Gina Carano ... a serious and talented fighter.

Talented, somewhat. Serious, not at all. Carano missed weight for at least one fight and had to have multiple attempts at weighing in for others. When she fought Cyborg she was destroyed in the first round. She was better than Rousey, but she used MMA as a platform into Hollywood and quit fighting the moment Cyborg obliterated her.

You are right that she was the real trailblazer for WMMA. Without Carano there is no Rousey, Holm, Tate, or a host of others that have actually made good money.
RIP the account of Sophie Cees.

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Offline WinnersPrize

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2017, 12:35:45 PM »
I personally think that Women MMA wasn't big before, because it was practiced by mostley women, who where... lets say a bit more masculine in appearance.
Which is totally cool, but not the type of women, the majority of people like to watch on television.

Ronda Rousey, Miesha Tates and Gina Carano, where one of the first 'model good looks' women, with the charisma and skill to give an actual good fight show.
They where in my opinion put up against other good looking women, who weren't such good fighters.

Ronda Rousey, was never a super strong fighter, she was stronger than the people she was put up against.
Nunes, is actually a good fighter, she has this masculine fighting aura, just radiating off her body.
Holly Holmes, was an actual good fighter.

I believe that, that's the reason for Ronda Rousey's downfall. She was never 'that good'.


I also think that UFC turned in to the sporst equivalent of WWE. Since Dana White keeps protecting his poster boys/girls from good fighters, with less charisma.

But these are just my 2 cents.

:D

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Online sinclairfan

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2017, 06:03:04 PM »
The history of female MMA in the UFC doesn't start with Rhonda Rousey.  It starts with Gina Carano ... a serious and talented fighter.

...but who was also broken psychologically by her first loss.

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Offline DogWithABone

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2017, 06:22:40 PM »
I am so glad the fight ended the way it did, it would of been hard viewing watching her get banged up like that round after round.... The only fights I've seen of hers in full are the two Tate fights, the holly fight and this one. Can anyone tell me a fight she's been in where she's dominated the standing game, because watching the Nunes fight and Holly fight she was very much out her league.... someone put it well.. fish out of water.
Respect for what she's done for Women MMA, but she needs to retire if she's not prepared to work on her boxing... is the hunger even still there?

She dominated Bethe Correia and Sarah McMann on the feet. McMann is an olympic level wrestler with no standup game. Correia is a pumped up midget that couldn't swat a fly.
RIP the account of Sophie Cees.

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Offline DJP60

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2017, 07:42:09 PM »
i am a HANDSOME PERVERT and i made 6 figures of Rhonda so ty ty ty Ronda. lol
I have an interest in female
hooligans fights too as well as Russian girl gang fights!!
i also pay entertainers to fight 1 another and i get photos of them here in Las Vegas Nv Sabrina is now 6-1 Yes i pay strippers to fight each other for $$.

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Offline DoYouKnowWhoIAm?

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2017, 07:49:03 PM »
{alt}

 

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Offline HumiliationOne

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2017, 12:59:42 AM »
As far as the question of Ronda being a pioneer, there is no reasonable argument against that. Someone mentioned Carano in the UFC. That never happened. Ronda is the reason that women fight in the UFC.
And she also is to blame for her failure to evolve.  Most notably for keeping her terrible coach.  It is difficult to know even with a good coach if she was ever going to have good footwork and head movement.  That is something that comes with a type of athleticism that she might have never been able to develop.
Someone above mentioned the fallout from the Holm loss and I could not agree more. But again even taken that loss out of the equation there is a shot that Nunes (and I am talking about Nunes since she moved to ATT) would have done the same thing to her.  Nunes keeps distance and punches with power that girls like Ronda and Tate can not deal with.  SHE IS A BEAST and after to her last 2 wins where she did not break a sweat her confidence is only growing.  Could be a very long and brutal (for her opponents) run in female bantamweight division.

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Offline krizanti

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2017, 05:48:13 PM »
As far as the question of Ronda being a pioneer, there is no reasonable argument against that. Someone mentioned Carano in the UFC. That never happened. Ronda is the reason that women fight in the UFC.
And she also is to blame for her failure to evolve.  Most notably for keeping her terrible coach.  It is difficult to know even with a good coach if she was ever going to have good footwork and head movement.  That is something that comes with a type of athleticism that she might have never been able to develop.
Someone above mentioned the fallout from the Holm loss and I could not agree more. But again even taken that loss out of the equation there is a shot that Nunes (and I am talking about Nunes since she moved to ATT) would have done the same thing to her.  Nunes keeps distance and punches with power that girls like Ronda and Tate can not deal with.  SHE IS A BEAST and after to her last 2 wins where she did not break a sweat her confidence is only growing.  Could be a very long and brutal (for her opponents) run in female bantamweight division.

Ditto!

One thing I’d like to add is that; if you have a glass chin like Ronda, even the best of coaching will not help. In both Holm and Nunes fights after eating a couple of punches in her face, she was totally groggy and her game plan went down the drain. If you’ve watched Amanda Nunes vs. Shevchenko match, you understand what I mean. In spite of receiving a lot of damage on her face, Shevchenko fought toe to toe for 5 rounds…incredibly dominated Nunes in the final round and almost won the fight. She is smaller than both Nunes and Ronda.


Throughout the fight Ronda’s coach was screaming “Move your head! Move your head”.…I bet she didn’t even hear it. I doubt that her coach did not train her foot work and head movements. Just like having knock-out power in your punches is a God given given gift, so is dancing around your opponent like Ali or Dominic Cruz. Some people simply can not be coached those skills. Ronda is a great grappler but apparently does not have the talent for boxing. Her earlier success is reminiscent of Royce Gracie’s success…in the early stages of MMA, being good at grappling was a sure way of winning fights, but as men’s MMA evolved Royce Gracie became history and the same thing happened in women’s MMA with Ronda Rousy.

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Offline HumiliationOne

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2017, 06:27:01 PM »
The only things I would disagree with is term glass chin. To me that means that a fighter gets knocked out cold easily. Ronda does not go all the way out but she certainly did not know where she was after just the first jab. You can see her legs go weak and get close together and she got a bewildered look on her face. 
And I will rewatch the fight with Valentina but I don't think she took flush shots to face like Ronda. She certainly took punishment but because of her excellent stand up game she was able to avoid that on feet. On the ground she took good shots but Nunes is most lethal standing where she torques her entire body into punches. Her arms are long, her hands are huge and she punches like no other 135lbs woman.

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Offline DogWithABone

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2017, 07:45:32 PM »


Throughout the fight Ronda’s coach was screaming “Move your head! Move your head”.…I bet she didn’t even hear it. I doubt that her coach did not train her foot work and head movements. Just like having knock-out power in your punches is a God given given gift, so is dancing around your opponent like Ali or Dominic Cruz. Some people simply can not be coached those skills. Ronda is a great grappler but apparently does not have the talent for boxing. Her earlier success is reminiscent of Royce Gracie’s success…in the early stages of MMA, being good at grappling was a sure way of winning fights, but as men’s MMA evolved Royce Gracie became history and the same thing happened in women’s MMA with Ronda Rousy.

It's pretty well known that he only trained her on pads and the punching bag. No footwork, no sparring, nothing at all to prepare her for actually getting hit.
RIP the account of Sophie Cees.

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Offline krizanti

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Re: Ronda Rousey .. did she sow the seeds of her own downfall?
« Reply #14 on: January 04, 2017, 08:31:00 PM »

It's pretty well known that he only trained her on pads and the punching bag. No footwork, no sparring, nothing at all to prepare her for actually getting hit.

Well known by who?

http://www.maxim.com/sports/mikaela-mayer-training-ronda-rousey-2016-10